Food banks

Scott@KarmaContent

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I've got my controversial head on today.

We keep hearing about how many food banks have had to be created to help people in need to feed themselves. However, whilst I know there are some genuine cases, do you think there are a lot of people who don't really need them.

That is, if you smoke, drink or have a subscription TV service, are you really that needy? And have we become a society that just expects handouts, instead of doing what people did during the war and the miner's strike and make do and learn to be more resourceful with basic ingredients?

:eek:
 

caledonia1972

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I think there's a lot in what you say.

There was a programme on not so long ago where they took "famous" people to live with people on benefits to see how they managed. The people who were living within their means and not living extravagantly were doing fine. The ones who were hiding the bank statements down the back of the sofa and getting into debt for Christmas were the ones at the food banks.

There are some people in real hardship and this is nothing new. What is new is the inability to cook and "make do" - anyone whose ever been on sites like netmums will know that some people struggle with the very basics of making soup or feeding their children with baked potatoes, they'd rather have sky tv and an iPhone. You see lots of threads about "down to my last 20p until my tax credits come through" and at the bottom it says "posted from my iPhone/blackberry/ipad". People take on expensive mobile contracts, or get pets or just keep having kids without thinking about how they'd cope if their situation changed.

Unless you're permanently disabled and unable to work doing anything at all, out of work benefits should not be enough to have fancy tablets, the full sky package and pets.

We're on holiday in York at the moment and there are LOADS of adverts up in shop and café windows advertising for staff - things are definitely improving. (Quite fancied the 20 hours a week in White Stuff myself, but the commute from Glasgow would be a killer).
 

Jon

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York eh! - Pop down the A64 and say Hi! lol

Back on topic

Just look at the number of people who post on the Introduce Yourself thread and are DESPERATE for money and need to find work etc..

And then never return or don't want to do things when they are offered work on a plate

Normal work isn't good enough, it has to be THEIR kind of online work or some other rubbish
 

Quilla

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There are definitely people who use food banks who don't actually need them. Some people would rather keep all their creature comforts and nip down to the food bank than buy their own food and not have that expensive phone/TV contract. However, people who exploit the system will always exist.

I had a close friend who really struggled for a few months when he battled with mental health issues and waited for his ESA claim to be processed. He was technically homeless and the help he received was fantastic. He was put up in a complex where his rent was extremely low and he managed to get a decent amount of food from the food banks near him. Sometimes when I'd see him he literally had 50p to his name. He needed the food banks at that time, so I find it hard to be completely objective.
 

Flitterbug

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I think it's like anything like this though there will be the people that really need it and then there will be those mentioned above. I don't usually get involved in controversial threads but I do feel that it's a shame that those who really need the help often get judged wrongly - but until you dig a bit deeper you just don't know what each individuals situation is.
 

Twiggy

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I think they have a place, I know of people who have used them while waiting on (legit) benefit payments and I think that this type of thing is better than having to apply for emergency money.

As far as I know, you cannot just 'nip' down to a foodbank. You have to have a referral from a social worker or similar, and then I think you can only attend about four times.
 

Scott@KarmaContent

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I said before that there are some genuine people who really do need foodbanks, and it's good that they exist for those people who really need them. But if I was in the position (which I have been) where I'm absolutely skint and struggling to feed my family and keep a roof over their head then self respect would make me do everything in my power to do so which would mean giving up luxuries and non-essential things. Only then would I go and use a food bank.
 

katykicker

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Yes you can't just pop in and say you're poor. They want a referral from social services, jobcentre etc.
 

sparkleandshine

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It's wrong, of course it's wrong, especially considering we are the sixth richest country in the world. It's because benefits and increasingly also wages are woefully inadequate. I know of people who have been in desperate need of food banks but would rather starve than say so because they were so ashamed. It's not right that people should have to feel like that. Of course 99.9% of parents will instinctively cut back on so called luxuries in order to feed their children, it's just what people do as human beings. But who cares really if the people using them smoke (an addiction - not so easy to just stop) have the odd drink or watch a bit of tv - it's hardly owning a private island in the Caribbean - they should be able to afford to do all of that too surely - this government just doesn't seem to care and that's why we need a new one. This country never used to be so crap.
 

katykicker

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I care actually. Why should someone on benefits have enough money to smoke? Or drink?!

I don't smoke or drink anymore, but when money was tight for us two years ago that was the first thing that went from our household budget and as things improved I didn't bother bringing the smoking back, because I had chose to stop. That's about willpower. An addiction to smoking isn't the same as drink or drugs IMO. It is very easy to just stop. If you want to. Or if you can't afford it. I decided to stop and stopped the same day. Then again I must have high willpower as I have made a lot of things work in life when others we know couldn't.

Benefits should be inadequate for people that are seeking a job. You should have enough for gas, electric, water and food. Not Sky, iPhones, phone contracts, expensive phone/broadband packages or anything else that is really a luxury.

I'm in a fortunate position, we rely on no benefits in our home, as we have a nice income these days. I do know someone on disability benefit and that is not inadequate at all. She has a great life, lots of money and lots of holidays.

I also know someone who is on income support and claims to not have a lot of money. Doesn't stop them having Sky, fake nails, hair extensions, designer footwear and much more.

I don't tar all people on benefits with the same brush but seems to me that the system isn't actually inadequate at all, people just make excuses for why they deserve things when they don't work or why they can't afford to do things which they could afford by cutting back on non-essentials.

I know LOTS of people who work, and don't claim any topup benefits, who can't afford holidays, and several on benefits who go abroad at least twice a year.

This country never used to be so crap = we used to let people sit at home for 18 years of their kids lives having everything they want in life while others worked hard to pay for it/the country got into more debt.
 

katykicker

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As an aside while I disagree with what you're saying I don''t make any of those judgements based on speaking to anyone on this forum, but people I know in real life :)
 

Jon

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Yeah I don't get why we blame the whole country instead of the people
 

sparkleandshine

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Benefits should be adequate to meet essential needs. The minimum wage should be adequate to meet essential needs plus a little bit extra - for treats, savings and so on. As you climb the career ladder, get more qualifications, take on more responsibilities you should get more. You should be adequately rewarded for the work that you do and the value you add to the organisation.

The arguments come because people can't agree what is essential and what is not. I once got into a discussion on netmums where people were saying they didn't even think food for the parents was essential - as long as they had enough to feed the kids - I couldn't believe what I was reading.

Nobody needs an iPhone or sky tv but I would say in this day and age you should not begrudge people things like a basic tv and a basic mobile phone, on benefits or not. They don't cost a lot.
 

sparkleandshine

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yes it's not the country it's the people, specifically the one at number 10 :D

that's not to say that we were living in some kind of utopia under the last government either
 

caledonia1972

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sparkleandshine said:
Benefits should be adequate to meet essential needs. The .

Absolutely agree.

Benefits should be a safety net - there to help you back on your feet when you've fallen on hard times and until you get another job.

Essential needs are food, rent, electricity.

Luxuries are sky tv, pets, smoking, drinking, holidays, savings etc. If people on benefits are choosing to buy a packet of fags over feeding their kids then they are failing as parents and there's an argument that benefits should be paid in vouchers so they can't buy booze or fags.

In the 90s when I was a student I worked in Spain as a teacher for a year. One month the government decided not to pay us, promising double the following month. (This was not uncommon at the time). Luckily we had a sympathetic landlady but along with my two flatmates we just had to manage on the £10 a week we were bringing in from private lessons. We ate a LOT of lentils and couldn't afford to do anything. A lot of people now don't seem to want to deal with a bit of hardship, they expect to be bailed out of every situation.

I also agree with Jon that a lot of people want to work, but on their terms. I have lost count of the number of threads on parenting forums which either start "I can only accept a job 10-2, term time only" or "have been offered a job but don't want to take it as it'll affect my benefits".
 

bordercolliefan

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Scott is being very controversial today! ;D However, here's my two pence worth!
Kind of fusion of both of his posts really....
I do agree with Katie about people getting rid of essentials before using a foodbank, however, some like sky and mobile phones have contracts that aren't always easy to get out of. Also, as a massive pet lover, and someone who helps out at animal rescues, I would rather people keep their pets (which helps with stress etc) and use a foodbank then I would them getting rid of them.

As for blaming THIS government for everything, it wasn't THIS government that got us into this mess. Labour overspent and sold our gold at a ridiculous price and did not regulate the banks when borrowing got out of control. To my mind, it is people themselves to blame. They borrowed too much, over extending themselves a lot more than they could ever afford to repay. I do agree with the Conservatives in some respects, work should pay better than staying at home on benefits! And I work for a government company that has had their budget cut to the bone and had a £400 pay rise in 5 years! What was a reasonably paid job with a lot of responsibility now pays the equivalent of an admin person locally! I am also on a National Pay Scale (which Labour brought in) which sounds fair enough, however, a house in a not so nice area near where I live is minimum £185,000!!! Up North (and I know there are a lot of you on here :/ ) can be considerably less and yet we are all on the same wage. London has a weighting allowance but we don't which strikes me as a bit unfair.

As for the other parties (in Scott's first post):
Labour - I wouldn't trust with the contents of my piggy bank. Just don't tell my dad cos he was quite high up in the union when he was working.
Lib Dem - Don't agree with a lot of their policies, however, I think in coalition they have curbed the Tory's "nastier" side
UKIP - Agree with not sending foreign aid money to countries with a nuclear programme! And I think we should have a serious conversation on immigration without fear of being branded a racist! Not that I mind who comes here as long as they are working, however, it does impact on road infrastructure, NHS, house building, schools etc so to my mind there has to be some sort of cap. Unfortunately, there are too many people in that party who should never be allowed to stand as MP.
Greens - Nice people but that's about it. Dread to think what would happen if they got in!
SNP/Plaid Cymru - ..........................

Sorry about the long post! :) It's only my humble opinion.........
 

sparkleandshine

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we used to get that a lot, promoting the avon representative opportunity, it's just down to ignorance, they would actually be better off working in any kind of job and claiming tax credits. Plus fear, some people are really terrified of making a change, that's why they would rather stay on benefits then take a risk on a job that might not work out. Paying benefits in vouchers isn't a bad idea and it would put people's minds at rest that the money is actually going where it should.

My hairiest no food experience was as a teenager at Glastonbury, my friend thought I had the food money, I thought she did, neither of us actually had it! So after one day of basically not eating at all on the second day after lots of 'you ask him, no you ask him, etc' we found a friendly stall holder who thought our predicament was hilarious and gave us a few free baked potatoes! :D
 

Quilla

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Yes, I shouldn't have said 'nip in' to a food bank as I know they do require some kind of referral form.

I just think the government have it completely wrong.
bordercolliefan said:
work should pay better than staying at home on benefits
I completely agree! I have spoken to so many people who have said they're not going to return to work because they'd get less money than they do on benefits. Of course there are other reasons why people work, and some people would take a cut so they didn't have to rely on handouts, but that is ridiculous. I am curious though, who would you vote for?
 

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