Coronavirus Discussion So.... The Coronavirus / COVID-19

micameyerstarturn

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I actually DO get not trusting the government with what they say. It's all half truths / holding back etc a lot of the time from them which can be frustrating but I don't get why the NHS / ONS etc would ever lie about what they are seeing, the data they are bringing in

So why are some doctors and nurses and scientists talking up against the lockdowns, the extreme fear being pumped out, the out of date data being used and the vaccine, which some are calling poison?

Just ask yourself why are all these people who have studied and trained to work in the medical field, to help and save lives would talk up against the governments response and extreme measures?

There are rumours online that many doctors and nurses have been silenced to not speak up. Others say it's a total lie.

Do your own research. Listen to what people are saying especially the ones who are producing evidence or proof. There are books, videos, podcasts, youtube channels like 'Sky news Australia' and 'Talk radio' who are talking to politicans, doctors, medical experts and journalists.
 

EdibleDormouse

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I'm no fan of this government, and I choose to believe approximately 20% of what they tell me. However, to play devil's advocate, running a country is hard, and decisions will always be made that were, with hindsight, the wrong ones. This isn't a statement in defence of the government, it's a statement of fact. For what it's worth, I agree that lockdowns just kick the can down the road, but since we're now within sight of a vaccine, the can doesn't have to be kicked all that much further. To save probably around 10-15,000 lives between now and April, it's worth it.

I've said it before, I'll say it again, numbers do not lie. It's like expecting water not to be wet. They always behave in the same way, and no matter how bad at maths you might have been at school, 2 + 2 does not, and never will, equal 5. Reading anything into the gaps is understandable, but frankly, no dice.

Also, on the rapidity of the vaccine; I know people that work in vaccine development. They're also all over Twitter if you care to look for them, being wonderfully open about what they do and how they do it. The reason vaccines usually take 5-10 years? 6-10 months of development, and 4-8 years of chasing funding. Nothing more sinister than that. Simple capitalism. No money in it? No funding.

Also, astrologers and psychics? Do me a bloody favour. The ignore button is a wonderful thing.
 
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Jon

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Yeah read that the other day from numerous vaccine companies (or dark overloads depending on your take) about the reason vaccines usually take so long isn't the science part it's the funding / admin side!
 
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micameyerstarturn

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See EdibleDormouse and Jon, you have a right to believe what you have researched, read or been told. There is evidence, proof and opinions on both sides. There are always going to be people who agree with you and some who disagree with you

Please understand people have different views. People who do not believe everything or even half of what the media and goverment are saying. They are not conspiracy theorists or looking for conspiracies everywhere.
 

Jon

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So are we saying Coroanvirus infection numbers are being inflated due to the impending 'great reset'?
 

EdibleDormouse

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So are we saying Coroanvirus infection numbers are being inflated due to the impending 'great reset'?
Of course not. Or not deliberately. I'm inclined to believe the massive 33,000 odd cases one day last week was down to crap admin and some double counting.

Unfortunately, the 'Great Reset' has been conflated by the tinfoil hat wearers with Agenda 21 and other QAnon crap. Everything you need to know about the Great Reset has been out in the open for some time. Most of it isn't remotely sinister. Make the world a fairer, nicer place to live with more international co-operation? Sounds good to me.

A little bit of truth has been mixed in with a whole heap of festering bollocks designed to distract people who are already (rightfully) scared because the world has shifted sideways. Take a good look at the 'intelligence' (I use the word loosely) behind things like this - Icke, Bannon etc. It's in their (financial) interests to stir people up.

Sorry (not sorry) if I'm getting vociferous. This is my personal soapbox, and a hill I am willing to die on.
 

Jon

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R number still dropping


The R number for the UK continues to fall and is now between 1 and 1.1, according to data released by the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage).

The R number is a way of rating coronavirus or any disease's ability to spread. It's the number of people that one infected person will pass on a virus to, on average.

Last week, the coronavirus R number in the UK was between 1 and 1.2.

As you can see from the graph above, the R number estimates vary across different parts of the country. It could be as low as 0.8 in north-west England, but more than 1.2 in south-east England.

Today's estimate doesn't yet reflect the impact of the second lockdown in England, which began on 5 November.
 

Karonher

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Not much I can say after EdibleDoormouse has written exactly what I think.

I have friends who are nurses and paramedics and it is a big problem. They and their colleagues are being pushed to their physical and mental limits. To hear people not believing it and saying the NHS are being bribed and threatened to keep quite is annoying to say the least. Maybe they would like to go to some of the wards and help out it as there is no risk - or maybe wheel out the dead bodies.

How many nurses have said it is not a problem. There was one in Cornwall and while it may be low there is is still increasing. I noticed in a post above it was asked why people not believing were called anti-vaxers but not why those following the rules are called sheeple - including a friend who is a paramedic and that was for wearing a mask in a shop - and she was in uniform having taken another covid patient to the hospital that morning.

Its hard not going out and seeing friends but it will hopefully just be for another 6 months or so. Why is being considerate and sensible too hard for some people?
 

Jon

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Every adult in England should be offered the coronavirus vaccine by April, according to NHS draft plans.

The rollout plans will see everyone those aged 18 to 50 start being offered jabs in January, after older people and care workers are vaccinated.

The provisional timetable - which depends on the authorisation and arrival of millions of vaccines - sees care home residents and staff, NHS workers, and those in their 70s and 80s start receiving jabs before Christmas.

But a far wider rollout is planned in the new year.

While those aged between 50 and 70 should be offered jabs during January, along with younger people with health conditions, those aged between 18 and 50 should begin being offered jabs by the end of the month.

The draft plans, seen by Health Service Journal, say that the “bulk” of vaccines of the last group are likely to occur in March, meaning that almost the whole population should have been offered jabs by Easter.

The dates pencilled in for beginning each group are:

  • Care home residents and staff, healthcare workers - from beginning of December
  • Ages 80 plus - from mid-December
  • Everyone aged 70-80 - from late December
  • Everyone aged 65-70 - from early January
  • All high and moderate risk under 65s - from early January
  • Everyone aged 50-65 - from mid January
  • Everyone aged 18-50 - from late January, but with the bulk of this group vaccinated during March
 

homie

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Every adult in England should be offered the coronavirus vaccine by April, according to NHS draft plans.

The rollout plans will see everyone those aged 18 to 50 start being offered jabs in January, after older people and care workers are vaccinated.

The provisional timetable - which depends on the authorisation and arrival of millions of vaccines - sees care home residents and staff, NHS workers, and those in their 70s and 80s start receiving jabs before Christmas.

But a far wider rollout is planned in the new year.

While those aged between 50 and 70 should be offered jabs during January, along with younger people with health conditions, those aged between 18 and 50 should begin being offered jabs by the end of the month.

The draft plans, seen by Health Service Journal, say that the “bulk” of vaccines of the last group are likely to occur in March, meaning that almost the whole population should have been offered jabs by Easter.

The dates pencilled in for beginning each group are:

  • Care home residents and staff, healthcare workers - from beginning of December
  • Ages 80 plus - from mid-December
  • Everyone aged 70-80 - from late December
  • Everyone aged 65-70 - from early January
  • All high and moderate risk under 65s - from early January
  • Everyone aged 50-65 - from mid January
  • Everyone aged 18-50 - from late January, but with the bulk of this group vaccinated during March
Good. lets get it done then. Everyone that wants one can have one then we can get back to normal normal. And not any new normals.
 
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homie

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EdibleDormouse

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Rather shown your hand there, haven't you? Even the US Spectator call Paul Joseph Watson a "post-truth digital libertarian". He's a self-described conspiracy theorist.

Like I said earlier, the Ignore button is a truly beautiful thing.
 
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Jon

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Vaccination centres are being set up


Also I PERSONALLY know someone who's mum works at a council looking after care homes and got en email today telling them to get ready to begin vaccinating from start of December
 

Bugboybill

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It’s all well and good saying stuff like “Do your own research, there’s plenty on YouTube etc.” The problem is that much of that stuff is complete and utter cobblers. A friend sent me a YouTube video via FB Messenger last week from a woman purporting to have “proof that the Oxford vaccine was injecting us with DNA from aborted babies, would alter our DNA and had huge known adverse reactions”. Unfortunately the woman had no understanding of the science involved, couldn’t even pronounce the words properly and was talking utter cobblers. I know this, because I have worked in a related field my entire working life. I explained to my friend that this was the problem with social media. It gives a voice to idiots, and many believe anything they see or hear on the internet like it’s fact. It’s the same sort of thing with Trump supporters. They see a list of “dead people who voted” and treat it as fact even when it is shown to be drivel.
 

Sherliarty

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What are people's views on Christmas? I would love to have Christmas but do not think it's worth another month of lockdown. I'd rather wait and treat Valentines as if it is Christmas!
 

Bugboybill

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It's a difficult one. Some people live near family and have been able to see them regularly. Others live further away and only see family a few times a year, so to them it's more important. I would be happy to see it limited to 3 days and no more than 6 people. The problem is that plenty will just do as they please anyhow. Several people have told me they will do what they normally do and to hell with covid and the law.
 
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